Why will people not listen?

[SSTC22]

Dear All,

I met with a friend I have known for many years and noticed a nasty looking mole along the hairline. I tried to impress on him the urgency of having this looked at by a dermatologist but the reply I got is that we all have to go sometimes! How idiotic a response is that?

I am a medical editor so I know what I am looking at, but talking to him is like talking to a brick wall. Instead, he left our meeting much sooner, presumably because he found me annoying or persistent.

My mother was the same. For years I pleaded with her to stop smoking and drinking spirits. Again, the stock reply was that it was her life and she knew best.

She then died horribly of oesophageal cancer, a nasty way to go.

Why will people not listen?

And I really find the ‘we all have to go sometimes’ statement incredibly irksome.

They do not think about who they leave behind and the hurtful gap they leave.

Life is too precious to be thrown away like this.

Is there any point trying to help?

Warmest wishes,

Sonia

[SadGirlfriend]

@SSTC22 I think you can only advise, give your opinion and leave it at that. I know what they mean as I also wouldn’t seek treatment for anything again, apart from pain relief. I have recently twice refused surgery to remove potential cancer as I simpy don’t want to go through anything like that, I’d rather not know. We cannot live others lives for them. They are aware as there is so much help and advice out there. Frustrating for you, I concede.

[SSTC22]

It is not just frustrating. It is desperately trying to stop someone from reaching a point of no return when there is something relatively simple they can do now before it is too late to do anything at all.

I was recently diagnosed with a precancerous lesion on my forehead that would not heal. Had I not seen a dermatologist and got prompt and fairly painless treatment, it could have progressed to something nastier requiring very invasive and painful treatment.

As human beings, we are not invincible. It is wise to acknowledge this and take heed before it is too late to do anything about it. This may not apply to all, but it does in some instances.

I am truly sorry about what you are going through and can see where you are coming from and how you reached your decision.

Ultimately, it is an individual choice.

[SueF1]

i agree its a personnal choice, i have medical things wrong but i wont have them sorted, i dont trust drs and certasinly dont trust hospitals. 30/40 yrs ago i might have done but not now. like your mum, i wont have anyone telling me to stop smoking, and after 50 yrs its not easy to do anyway.
i am also in the percentage of “we all have to die sometime” if your time is up. reminds me of a story someone told me yrs ago when she expl,ained why she wouldnt fly, she said its all very well saying flying is safe but what if the pilots time is up

[SSTC22]

I am sorry but I have to disagree with your point of view. To me, life is extremely precious and worth living the best I can.

I do not believe that all doctors should not be trusted. I have met very good and not so good doctors but by having a clear and informed dialogue, and doing some research beforehand, I have been helped and my life has improved. I am thankful for that.

The same for hospitals. Some I would not want to visit (like the one around the corner from where I live), but others give exceptional service and save many lives. For example, the Royal Marsden has some terrific surgeons who carry out amazing surgery that saves and even improves the lives of people with cancer and their families. They care and we should be grateful for their expertise and how they help us.

It is never too late to change lifestyle choices and get help for addictions (smoking, drinking, gambling to mention just three). These days, we have so many options and treatments available, often provided by people who care greatly.

I am sorry, but I cannot have a totally negative view of the medical profession. Knowledge is everything. My knowledge is probably wider than other people because of the job I do, but anyone can research and then make an informed choice.

Also, we must think of the people we leave behind and the hurt that losing someone causes. This is why we all use this forum.

Yes, we will all die sometimes. It is inevitable and part of life. No-one can stop that (well, at least not in my lifetime). But we can change how we live for the better both for ourselves and the people we love.

However bad life might get (and I have had my fair share of tragedies), it is worth living it to the best we can (within the limits of our biology and scientific knowledge).

So the question is (and I have been in that exact situation very recently), if I have a nasty-looking mole, would I try everything to find out what it is and how to best treat it? Of course I would!

As for my mother and her choice of not giving up smoking and drinking, I do not wish it on anyone to have to watch someone you love going through the pain she went through. She was only in her late sixties when she died. She could not drink, eat or even brush her teeth, which she hated not being able to do. Towards the end, she asked me, Should I go on? I said yes but I really should have said no. She was in so much pain and a shadow of herself. What a horrible way to go for someone who was a remarkable woman (and very healthy otherwise) and who could have lived for another 10 or even 20 years. So, if you ask me whether it is worth giving up smoking and drinking at any time during one’s life, I say 100%!

These are just my views and experiences and I certainly do not wish to offend anyone or impose my views on anyone else.

However, rather than saying ‘we all have to go sometimes’, let us embrace the beauty of life and live it the best (and healthiest) we can for ourselves and the people we love.

Best wishes to all,

Sonia

[Enorac]

My mother refused to go to hospital and so she died. My son refuses to see the doctor. I am very upset. My husband refused to go to hospital until he had decided. He died leaving it too late. I know my friends husband forced his son to go into hospital when he was dying against his son’s own wishes to die at home.
Yes I feel frustrated and my mother in law died unnecessarily because she refused to go back to the GP until she had left it too late and had no chance. But I called an ambulance when it was obvious she was seriously ill as I did with my father when I found him seriously ill but the doctor hadn’t sent him to hospital and he had no telephone in the house.

[SueF1]

i want to say first of all that you are not offending anyone but i think we know too much nowadays and we research too much on the net. it was much easier when you just got on with life and stopped worrying about every little ache and pain.
thing is most people are here do not want to live life to the fullest unless its with the person they have just lost, and for some it can take yrs to move on or even never.
smoking is the only thing i do and i have looked at the remedies and the side effects are worse than the smoking plus my dr said if i want to give up to do it over the course of about 2 yrs as the shock could kill me. maybe if i had given up when i was younger but at nearly 70 i am not going to now.
last thing i want to do is live forever thank you very much or into really old age. sorry

[Enorac]

My great aunt smoked and died at 97 my quasi father in law smoked and died at 93. but those two persons were not over weight, ate healthily, had alcoholic drinks and a laugh and kept physically active.
They didn’t give it up. But they were sensible in what they did otherwise.
They wanted to keep living despite loosing love of their lives years before.
My auntie used to telephone me for a chat. I loved her chatting even if it was about the same thing . Loved it if she wrote letters to me and always ended about her bad chest through smoking. She offloaded how she missed her husband when he died. Bless her. She did do it her way

[Pest]

My son who had special needs from birth, died aged 47 from secondary bone cancer. He had no symptoms until April 2023 ,when he complained of pains in hip and spine. He went to the walk in clinic , the doctor said muscular rub deep heat in. I got the Gp to arrange a appointment to try and get physio . The physio looked at him said it was muscular ,and said she would put he down for physio but there was a 3 months waiting list.He continued his life ,enjoying going out ,he was so brave. Then at the end of April 2023 ,the pain was so bad he could not get out of bed . I went to Where he lived, tried to get an ambulance,in the end the carer and I got him down the stairs and I got a mini cab. At the hospital the young doctor there said she could feel a something on his hip.
It was a mass on the hip he also had one on the spine . He died on the 17th of July,nobody would listen. They could not find primary at first, just before he died they found a small gastric ulcer 20mm. My point is he was on medication for 23 years, I do wonder why people on long term medication especially with special needs are not checked regular for gastric ulcers etc. The world has lost a very special person , who was loved by so many people. The only thing that I had is he lived life to the full. Mencap raised over £300 for the guts charity and his drama group raised £362 for London Red air ambulances . FLY HIGH my darling son,helping people like you always did​:two_hearts:

[Pest]

He never smoked ,drank,did not like a lot of red meat,was on the go all the time,was not obese,only had one tiny filling in his teeth. The only thing because what he was born with he had epilepsy and a under active thyroid which he had to take medication for since the age of 22. Life is so unfair.

[Enorac]

Yes life is unfair

[Burgled]

I know. I’m dealing with this, with my mum. The list of things we need to deal with is getting longer and longer.

She’s finally going to a dentist for the first time in 10 years (only partially her fault; NHS dentists aren’t available, but a really nice private one has just opened locally).

She hasn’t been to the optician in years.

She is on a new BP med that is causing her a cough and psoriasis but she “would rather leave it for a while”.

And she’s been referred to the dermatologist for a mole removal, but she has 2 additional moles that she was too shy to ask about.

In the beginning, after losing Dad, I sat in consultations with her, but she no longer wants me to do that, so she comes away having told half a story and refusing offers of help. For example, I asked for a referral for a sleep apnoea test for her, and she subsequently canceled it.

It’s frustrating and aggravating because I know full well how much pressure we need to put on healthcare workers to show that we are serious. I was pissed off that my dad kept coming back from his GP practice (didn’t see an actual GP, just one of those people whose qualification is from the back of a Kelloggs cereal pack) with no diagnosis from a 5-year long cough, and it ended up being ischemic heart disease, which is how I’ve found myself here.

I’ve made some massive headway with my mum, but it’s a long hard uphill slog.

[Enorac]

My mum refused to go into hospital every time she had a mini stroke so she died.
She would rather head bury than go back into hospital after her first attack they kept her in there for six weeks and she hated it so much. I knew what the outcome would be but she was adamant

[Burgled]

Oh bless, I’m sorry to read that. We try our best to protect our loved ones. It’s sad that they fear healthcare institutions, but I can see why they do: my mum really gets rattled by people who don’t have a good bedside manner, and I’ve witnessed a few.

[SueF1]

i dont trust drs or hospitals as far as i can see them. 30 yrs ago maybe but not now. i can understand why a lot of people would rather suffer the problems they have than get them sorted out

[Burgled]

You’re correct. I’m currently chasing a referral for my mum. They received it a week and a half ago and I’ve rung twice about it. It’s still awaiting triage. It’s actually been going on since about August because they had this awful teledermatology thing, where someone took a photo of her skin complaint, to then be reviewed by a doctor, who she then saw in person, who then referred her for mole removal. Prior to that, the GP practice let a question go unanswered about her referral to teledermatology. Thankfully a competent secretary stood in and sorted it without needing to wait for the nurse.

But, yes, the healthcare system isn’t fit for purpose, which only adds to the stress when my mum won’t go and get things checked out.

[Lydia3]

I am with Sue on this. It’s all very well to put your trust in GP’s, hospitals, consultants, and let’s be honest, once we are in the system we have no choice but to do so. As for mentioning the Royal Marsden, I know they are great and the lead on cancer, but have you or a member of your family tried referral to them? The best hospitals have long waiting lists, and sadly the terminally ill don’t have that time. So in regard to seeking help for a worrying symptom, yes of course you can seek help…if that is your choice…but Sonia, please hear experiences here, not everyone gets that quality and timely care they should, despite attending GP’s, multiple visits to A&E, and reaching out to appropriate departments. My daughter included. My husband included. Both are no longer here. Sue has a good point about what people here are going through - and none of us can deny anybody of individual choice, many of us here have experienced great suffering grief and loss, and don’t see a lifetime of ‘treatment’ or medication as a good prospect. Of course life is precious, every second, but it is ours to decide how to live it. Your faith in the medical field is admirable, but not my experience sadly. I am also in the medical area as a health care professional, so also have an expanse of knowledge and data. Having recently lost the biggest part of me, and knowing the pain of losing my child will never go, nor the void that she left, if I choose to wait out my days until I can be with her, that is my choice .

[Pest]

I agree with you to try and get to these cancer hospitals is a nightmare. My son was in hospital when his severe cancer was diagnosed, the young doctor there said she was trying to get him transferred to the royal free hospital in Hampstead. This is because the cancer was spreading so fast,and if he was there they had all the scan equipment etc there . He never made it, I do realise that more and more hospitals are trying so hard to get the equipment , but the way cancer is increasing and more secondary bone cancers they are finding it hard.

[Lydia3]

Pest, yes once you get to them the treatment is good. But getting there is another matter. Cancer has ideas of it’s own and walks or runs at it’s own pace. You take your child (adult) to A&E, if their symptoms are taken seriously (rare) they may be admitted to that hospital. Everything is a struggle to get and takes so much time. Trying to get them to those specialist hospitals is like carrying sacks of potatoes up a very steep hill. Everything was a struggle to get for my daughter, right upto her last days. She was diagnosed terminal in March and chose the hospice for her last days. Even the hospices have waiting lists, no beds, not in time anyway. She passed at home, it all happened so quickly in the last few days. Heartbreaking. I do feel she was let down, many times. She went from being told in A&E she had piles, and she was ‘too young to get cancer’ to being taken by bowel cancer. Faith in hospitals and doctors? I don’t think so. I know many try their best, but equally many do not seem competent at all. If they are unsure, TEST. Do not assume and send home.

[Burgled]

Mum got offered an appointment and she’s asked for it to be delayed.

I give up.