@Crazy_Kate I really wish the local self help groups could meet again. This virus has stopped like minded people being able to get together and talk. Before my John died I would never have joined a group or go to evening classes etc. We just wanted to be together and were so happy in each others company. How things have changed. I hope when I move I can find people to talk to sitting on the benches down by the sea. xxx
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@PeterL Thank you Peter. We never imagined, not so long ago, we would be talking on a forum like this did we? It’s a great shock to the mind, body and soul. No wonder we feel so lonely, grief stricken and hopeless. I also hope for a mellowing of the pain for you as you obviously loved your Gill as much as John loved me.
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@Bristles I understand how you feel. If life is precious why it is taken away so cruelly and for no reason? What did our loved ones and we do to deserve this? I question who or what is the decision maker in all of this. During the past weeks I have wanted to seek it/them out whoever or whatever they are and kill them. I am glad you believe in the afterlife. I wait to be with John again. That’s all I want.
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I’ll answer in the words of my darling husband…when he was told he was dying, as he dealt with cancer that took him with a catastrophic bleed that I saw…”It is what it is”. There is no blame for his suffering, or mine or our children and grandchildren.
He was 66, what we had was precious, together from 16 and 19. I will continue to live my life as he would want me to, having precious time with my family. Building on special memories. So, yes, our life is precious.
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Hello Bristles,
I’m so sorry to read about your situation, I can well understand the way you feel. Truly, truly heartbreaking.
Do you think you could do with some support? I’m pleased you have posted on this forum, but there is lots of other support out there, and I would really encourage you to reach out and speak to someone about how you are feeling.
I know @Hazel has posted a signposting message a couple of days ago, but I wanted to reiterate it in the hope it would encourage you to seek help. I don’t want to repeat our message word for word, as I want you to know we are here for you.
The Samaritans are always there 24/7 if it would help to talk one to one. They are on (116 123, or jo@samaritans.org).
Sue Ryder offers an online bereavement counselling service. This is a free service and sessions are held via video chat so you can attend from home. There’s more information about this service here: www.sueryder.org/counselling
Take care,
Audrey,
Online Community Team.
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Hi Bristles. I’m really sorry if I offended or upset you, that was not my intention. I was responding to your post of 20.10 and mistakenly tried to offer guidance.
Apologies,
Audrey
Online Community Team.
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Thank you Bristles for pointing that out, but you asked “If someone said to the millions of people worldwide who suffer excruciating pain 24 hours a day 7 days a week that life is precious and that life is a gift what do you think their reaction would be?“
My reply is my husband had 24/7 for 2 weeks of excruciating pain, fading away, not eating, and if asked if life was a gift and precious he would have said YES. He accepted he was dying. He knew he was leaving too early but that pain both physically and mentally would not have made life any less precious.
My thoughts are with all the amazing people who face battles with terminal illness with the determination just to be with us that little bit longer. Of course there are people who want their suffering to end and that is understandable. I’m not offering my opinion. I’m sharing my experience of loss and surviving just as you have Bristles.
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Asking whether life is precious is like asking if chocolate tastes good - it depends on the individual’s experience. It’s subjective (unless you have religious beliefs). If, despite your moments of suffering, you’re able to have moments in life when you really appreciate it, then life will be precious to you. But as @Bristles correctly says, what about all those people who aren’t able to enjoy life? Life certainly wasn’t precious to Aurelia Brouwers. Life certainly wasn’t precious to the 5000 people who killed themselves last year in the UK.
I believe life is precious because of my religious beliefs, but I certainly wouldn’t go around telling others that life is precious when they are struggling. That can actually make people feel guilty and ungrateful for being so unhappy. And what Geoff says is true - nature is brutal. The majority of living creatures have predators and are just struggling to survive. They don’t “enjoy” life for the greater part - most of their life is spent in fear. I am quite sure that if the hen which spends the entirety of its life in a large barn, laying eggs for our consumption before it is taken to the slaughterhouse to end up on our plate, could talk, it wouldn’t say life is precious, it would say life is quite awful.
It is good to be positive, I can appreciate the people telling others life is precious are trying to be positive, but there can be a fine line between positivity and toxic positivity.
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Bristles you are right. Each life is subjective to what they have been through. And the life they are leading. Everyone has a right to their own feelings and thoughts. There is no debate to be had. It is individual. It is personal. It is a human right to think and feel individually. We are all human. Suffering a loss. How we deal with it. How we cope with it. How we move forward. Is down to that unique individual. We will cope in our own way. It is not wrong it is not right. It is our path. And we choose it.
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Couldn’t agree more 
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Dear Bristles
You echo my sentiments perfectly. Life isn’t a gift. Neither is life precious. Its a process we were all thrust into the moment we were born. Did I ever ask to be born? NO! Life on this earth is an illusion. We seek to do good, we seek to be happy but 'something ’ always has to mess it all up. If I was at all religious- which I’m NOT! - I would say this world is run by the devil. A predatory domain governed by hurt, unfairness, suffering, and grief. To put it bluntly- a fucking hell hole. I love our children to bits BUT they have their own lives to lead. So the sooner I die and out of it the better.
Love and Light
Geoff x
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Count me in as well Bristles. If it weren’t for Flora, my beagle, I honestly believe that I would have gone to look for my darling wife by now. I t seems like a positive alternative to this hell.
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I took Flora for her walk this morning and a gentleman I only know by sight asked how Gill had died and how old she was (81) - he then apologised for obviously upsetting me. How he upset me!
The decided nip in the air foretold of winter and the long, long, lonely nights that lie ahead. I have accepted that I can’t cope with the prospect of Christmas without Gill and the inevitable sympathetic invitations from friends, so I will be off to try to find her before then. Fortunately Flora’s breeder has agreed to offer her a home in this eventuality. Wouldn’t it have been nice if we could all have flown off to a Greek island and taken care of each other over the winter? I hope your day will not be too bad.
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I don’t much care for the term ‘toxic positivity’. There is also a fine line between negativity and toxic negativity. I don’t think either has been displayed here. The word ‘toxic’ should never be applied to any of us on this forum. It’s a nasty word.
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Dear Peter, we all here will understand how upset you must have been. However, I like that the gentleman asked about your wife. So many avoid the mere mention of our loved one’s name and worse still, they avoid us. I love talking about my David but then I’m much further down this road than you. Your grief is raw, please don’t expect too much of yourself. The thought of long lonely nights can be distressing. I hate the winter. But you don’t need to go off to find your dear Gill; she knows where you are Peter. She’s with you. So during those dark wintery evenings, cuddle on the sofa with Flora and Gill in your heart and all those wonderful memories you must have. Spring will surely come in its own time and something to look forward to. Keep chatting to us Peter; I bet you have many interesting stories to tell. Tell us a bit more about Gill. We’d love to hear. How old is Flora? Dogs are such a comfort.
I live with my grief Peter and it has become a part of me but, as has been said before, my grief doesn’t define me. It’s a chapter in my book of life. Perhaps you’re on your final chapter but it’s not the end of your book, not yet. I remember similar words being written by a special lady on this forum and her words have stuck with me. She no longer contributes to this site but she’s very much still out there.
I’m a glass half full Peter, always have been. You take care; you sound like a lovely man. Sending love and hugs x
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Toxic positivity is an actual term which is discussed by psychologists - it is especially applicable to people suffering from mental health problems, and grief.
The clinical psychologist Dr Jaime Zuckerman discusses toxic positivity, and how it can be harmful to people.
Toxic positivity was, by its very definition, applied here by Omer when he told Johnswife to just focus on the present, and share her smile with others. I am sure he meant good, but telling that to someone who is struggling with their grief to the extent that they wish they did not wake up isn’t very helpful, and it can actually be detrimental.
Not being toxic positive doesn’t mean being negative. Grief should be about listening, and respecting the fact that people are different, and not projecting your personal experiences onto others. There’s a difference between telling someone “I was struggling like you, but a year later I am much better” and “You’ll be much better after a year, trust me”. The first is good positivity, you’re using your experience to give encouragement to someone that things can get better, the second is just projecting your experience onto someome else.
Of course, whether something was toxic positivity also depends on the relationship between the person making the comment, and the recipient. My landlord gave me a lecture on how I need to live my life - but I know him, and like him, and so his comment wasn’t taken as toxic positivity. In contrast, when my housemate’s new girlfriend, a 58 year old woman who has healthy parents in their 90s and who hasn’t experienced the loss of a close person, gave me a lecture on how I shouldn’t be sad, how life is for living, how she has told her kids to not be sad when she dies - that was toxic positivity. We don’t even know one another, it’s the first time we have met, and instead of listening, she’s giving a motivational TED talk. Not very good.
Generally speaking, telling someone who is hating their life that “life is precious” isn’t very helpful, in my opinion. I have never told anyone that, despite it being my religious belief. Others might disagree, and think it has benefits. That’s fine, people can have different opinions - we should be able to discuss them here. As Johnswife knows everyone here who was saying that life is precious, I did not actually consider it to be toxic positivity, but she doesn’t know Omer, and Omer doesn’t know her, and I don’t think his motivational messages were helpful.
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Willie Nelson is quoted as saying, “Once you replace negative thoughts with positive ones, you’ll start having positive results.” I like that.
Apparently every thought releases brain chemicals. Being focused on negative thoughts effectively saps the brain of its positive forcefulness, slows it down, and can go as far as dimming your brain’s ability to function, even creating depression. I didn’t know that. Perhaps it could be good advice to replace negative with positive. Glass half full and I make no apology for it.
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A very good point Peter. May I just say that I am so very pleased that we all wake up every morning. You’re all very precious. 
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@PeterL I have also made arrangements for my cat Jennie to go back to her breeder should I die. John and I made mirror wills leaving Jennie enough money to live out her life in luxury should we die together on one of our many adventures. Please don’t think about joining Gill before Christmas. I agree with @Bristles if we don’t die naturally I fear we will not be reunited with our darlings. They are certainly where the good ones go. I can’t risk it. I hope you won’t either.
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@Bristles Your love for Jean comes shining through. I truly hope you will be reunited with her one day. Won’t it be wonderful to run into their arms again. Take care.
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